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  • #31
    Yeah I think the whole point of signing Neuvirth is that he is a relatively cheap option as compared to Mason who will likely want something in the $5M+ range. Plus Neuvirth gives them a goalie they can expose in the expansion draft if they wanted to protect Stollie. Hextall continues to re-iterate he doesn't want to get stuck in situations where signing a FA this year will cause him cap issues in upcoming years for more important players to the team.

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    • #32
      Fyi, Stolarz was apparently injured in practice and left on crutches. Great news never ends for this team.

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      • #33
        Looking at the highlights of the first playoff games, makes at least me jealous
        Year in and year out we are discussing the guys at the backend and in the net who are simply in a lower tier than those guys playing for the prize consistently over the last years.

        Lundqvist, Price, Rask, Rinne, Holtby, Allen, Dubnyk all are to me elite goaltenders and are making saves that are simply mind-boggling. We have on the other hand average goaltending where I miss to see greatness coming from composure mixed with great agility and physical giftedness. Still even one of them thinks he is worth around 5 Mio that Dubnyk and Freddy Andersen are now earning.

        Looking at defencemen performance without naming the guys as everyone knows them, then an apparent thing is the mix of super great vets and great youngsters which is present practically for all of the playoff teams. We have at least 2-3 those great youngsters but there are zip veterans in the Pronger-like category which is heavily felt.

        Nothing new has been created and the championships are won from the backend. Therefore, although we can still work on grooming the guys, I say we will still be missing the main pieces of the puzzle which can be obtained only through trades. Might not be easy and likely painful but I would be supporting, while some of our forward values are high, trading them for a top-tier defenceman. Trades like Johansen for Jones is what I am looking for. Top goalie though would be harder to obtain, seeing how limited and not movable that class is.

        Something needs to be done as we are just sitting at the sideways otherwiseveating too much dust too my favour that this great organization simply does not deserve.
        Last edited by SweetAlabama; 04-14-2017, 09:06 AM.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by SweetAlabama View Post
          Looking at the highlights of the first playoff games, makes at least me jealous
          Year in and year out we are discussing the guys at the backend and in the net who are simply in a lower tier than those guys playing for the prize consistently over the last years.

          Lundqvist, Price, Rask, Rinne, Holtby, Allen, Dubnyk all are to me elite goaltenders and are making saves that are simply mind-boggling. We have on the other hand average goaltending where I miss to see greatness coming from composure mixed with great agility and physical giftedness. Still even one of them thinks he is worth around 5 Mio that Dubnyk and Freddy Andersen are now earning.

          Looking at defencemen performance without naming the guys as everyone knows them, then an apparent thing is the mix of super great vets and great youngsters which is present practically for all of the playoff teams. We have at least 2-3 those great youngsters but there are zip veterans in the Pronger-like category which is heavily felt.

          Nothing new has been created and the championships are won from the backend. Therefore, although we can still work on grooming the guys, I say we will still be missing the main pieces of the puzzle which can be obtained only through trades. Might not be easy and likely painful but I would be supporting, while some of our forward values are high, trading them for a top-tier defenceman. Trades like Johansen for Jones is what I am looking for. Top goalie though would be harder to obtain, seeing how limited and not movable that class is.

          Something needs to be done as we are just sitting at the sideways otherwiseveating too much dust too my favour that this great organization simply does not deserve.
          Every goalie you named was drafted by their org except Dubnyk, who was traded by one of the more poorly managed teams in recent history. There's not much choice other than to be patient for a goalie. At least Hextall has been drafting them. Stolarz already looks like at the least he will be a fine backup. Hopefully someone out of Hart, Sandstrom, or Lyon can be an answer for starter in the future.

          Now is not the time to trade a forward for a defenseman imo. No reason to block the path of one of the kids when Morin, Hagg, Sanheim, and Myers could all be banging on the door this summer. As it is already only 2 of the 4 really have spots available. Once the org has a better idea of what they have in all of them, one or more of them can be moved for help in whatever area is the biggest need.
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          • #35
            Originally posted by PinkFloydFreak87 View Post

            Every goalie you named was drafted by their org except Dubnyk, who was traded by one of the more poorly managed teams in recent history. There's not much choice other than to be patient for a goalie. At least Hextall has been drafting them. Stolarz already looks like at the least he will be a fine backup. Hopefully someone out of Hart, Sandstrom, or Lyon can be an answer for starter in the future.

            Now is not the time to trade a forward for a defenseman imo. No reason to block the path of one of the kids when Morin, Hagg, Sanheim, and Myers could all be banging on the door this summer. As it is already only 2 of the 4 really have spots available. Once the org has a better idea of what they have in all of them, one or more of them can be moved for help in whatever area is the biggest need.
            Patience is a good virtue, though I think then we will have to wait some 3-4 years more and maybe even more if Lyon or Sandstrom are not the real deals as I doubt that Stolie is on path to be that elite goalie.

            As to defencemen, then I am in full support of having the kids up with the big club and that is why I said that we have those 2-3 youngsters (Provy, Ghost, Morin/Haag) but we lack the experience and, what is more to that, we are lacking elite defencemen experience that Timonen, Pronger, Desjardins, Coffey (to a lesser extent), Galley brought to the club before.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by SweetAlabama View Post

              Patience is a good virtue, though I think then we will have to wait some 3-4 years more and maybe even more if Lyon or Sandstrom are not the real deals as I doubt that Stolie is on path to be that elite goalie.

              As to defencemen, then I am in full support of having the kids up with the big club and that is why I said that we have those 2-3 youngsters (Provy, Ghost, Morin/Haag) but we lack the experience and, what is more to that, we are lacking elite defencemen experience that Timonen, Pronger, Desjardins, Coffey (to a lesser extent), Galley brought to the club before.
              If you look at playoff success over the last half decade, veterans of that caliber were absolutely not a prerequisite. In fact, it was when young home grown guys started to hit their early prime years that teams were successful. Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson; Doughty, Muzzin, Martinez, Voynov; Letang, Maatta.

              Those players were supported by decent vets playing secondary or tertiary roles (obviously the Hawks had Timonen but he was playing a tertiary role at that point).

              Maybe you need to add a vet to put you over the top at some point in the future, but that's several years away at a minimum and its not a player of the caliber you referenced.
              "Oh, We got five. Ohhhhh."

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              • #37
                Originally posted by ELab2 View Post

                If you look at playoff success over the last half decade, veterans of that caliber were absolutely not a prerequisite. In fact, it was when young home grown guys started to hit their early prime years that teams were successful. Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson; Doughty, Muzzin, Martinez, Voynov; Letang, Maatta.

                Those players were supported by decent vets playing secondary or tertiary roles (obviously the Hawks had Timonen but he was playing a tertiary role at that point).

                Maybe you need to add a vet to put you over the top at some point in the future, but that's several years away at a minimum and its not a player of the caliber you referenced.
                Pronger-Niedermaier 2007
                Lindstrom (home grown but 35 at that moment)-Rafalski 2008
                Gonchar 2009
                Sopel 2010
                Chara-Ference 2011
                Mitchell-Scuderi 2012
                Oduya 2013
                Mitchell 2014
                Oduya 2015
                None 2016

                All guys 30+. Sorry, but I do not see a team do it without those guys and I put them all in the category of elite defencemen. Big exception 2016 as Penguins overall were young if I recall correctly. Exception in my opinion could be 2010 as Sopel not elite but played 20+ minutes; others home grown, 2013, 2015 - same team. I really hope that we can repeat the Hawks and be finally lucky as the Hawks drafted exceptionally well over the last few decades. Could argue on eliteness of Mitchell as well but the guy was playing over 20 minutes on a second pair.
                However, I am a little more concerned and I may well exaggerate this point but I think you need a very good teacher on the ice beside you for the learning curve to be steep enough and that is missing for this team when Sam and possibly Robert will be up next year together with Ivan.

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                • #38
                  heh. i'm guessing we have macdonald pencilled in as that veteran presence!

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by SweetAlabama View Post

                    Pronger-Niedermaier 2007
                    Lindstrom (home grown but 35 at that moment)-Rafalski 2008
                    Gonchar 2009
                    Sopel 2010
                    Chara-Ference 2011
                    Mitchell-Scuderi 2012
                    Oduya 2013
                    Mitchell 2014
                    Oduya 2015
                    None 2016

                    All guys 30+. Sorry, but I do not see a team do it without those guys and I put them all in the category of elite defencemen. Big exception 2016 as Penguins overall were young if I recall correctly. Exception in my opinion could be 2010 as Sopel not elite but played 20+ minutes; others home grown, 2013, 2015 - same team. I really hope that we can repeat the Hawks and be finally lucky as the Hawks drafted exceptionally well over the last few decades. Could argue on eliteness of Mitchell as well but the guy was playing over 20 minutes on a second pair.
                    However, I am a little more concerned and I may well exaggerate this point but I think you need a very good teacher on the ice beside you for the learning curve to be steep enough and that is missing for this team when Sam and possibly Robert will be up next year together with Ivan.
                    You have to go back to 2011 to have a primary piece be of the quality you initially referenced (Chara). Mitchell, Oduya, Scuderi, and Sopel were all solid vets (meh on Ference) but they weren't carrying the heavy weight and were not elite defensemen then or ever (Mitchell was probably the best of the bunch and he's not near the same league as Lidstrom, Pronger). Frankly, in four years Gudas could qualify for that portion of the list if he improves steadily.
                    "Oh, We got five. Ohhhhh."

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by swami24 View Post
                      Fyi, Stolarz was apparently injured in practice and left on crutches. Great news never ends for this team.
                      Stolarz has a torn MCL, which will require surgery. That is a ligament that usually does not require surgery to repair. It will be a long recovery.. so does a goalie have to be healthy to be exposed to the draft?

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